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Main
Date: 19 Jan 2007 07:53:57
From: Davej
Subject: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Where can I get latex to make temporary repairs? I would like to put
off the full replacement until later. Thanks!
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Date: 30 Jan 2007 11:37:15
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid > wrote:
> Per Davej:
>
> > Where would I go for seals for a Henri Lloyd?
> >Are sleeve diameters standardized? Thanks.
>
> Dunno from sleeves, but there seem tb at least 2 neck standards: the one you get
> when ordering from NRS and the one used by Koketat and sold by Offshore Systems.
>
This neck seems to be roughly 10" across and the sleeves seem to be 6"
across when flattened.
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Date: 30 Jan 2007 09:51:37
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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On Jan 19, 5:01 pm, "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid > wrote:
> Per cramer...@gmail.com:
>
> >Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
>
> Now that somebody's said it, I'd think bicycle inner tubes would be good -
> thinner, more flexy.... and they're available in different materials, although I
> don't have a clue what the significance on one material vs the other would be
> for gasket repair.
>
Well, I decided to try using rubber electrical tape since it is
thinner than the bicycle inner tube, but it didn't work well. The
surface of the tape seems to be too slippery. Maybe I need to rough it
up with sandpaper -- or maybe it isn't a compatible material?
Basically it seems that repairs are only possible where the seal
doesn't stretch much. Where would I go for seals for a Henri Lloyd?
Are sleeve diameters standardized? Thanks.
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Date: 31 Jan 2007 00:50:09
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Davej wrote:
> On Jan 19, 5:01 pm, "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote:
>> Per cramer...@gmail.com:
>>
>>> Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
>> Now that somebody's said it, I'd think bicycle inner tubes would be good -
>> thinner, more flexy.... and they're available in different materials, although I
>> don't have a clue what the significance on one material vs the other would be
>> for gasket repair.
>>
>
> Well, I decided to try using rubber electrical tape since it is
> thinner than the bicycle inner tube, but it didn't work well. The
> surface of the tape seems to be too slippery. Maybe I need to rough it
> up with sandpaper -- or maybe it isn't a compatible material?
Don't waste your time. You can repair it by gluing other types of rubber
to it, but tape isn't going to work.
> Basically it seems that repairs are only possible where the seal
> doesn't stretch much. Where would I go for seals for a Henri Lloyd?
> Are sleeve diameters standardized? Thanks.
Check with OS Systems (www.ossystems.com). They're the best source I've
found for seals and they make a broad range of sizes, which helps to
reduce the amount of trimming necessary to get the right fit. Several
dry suit manufacturers use their seals, I've never heard of Henri Lloyd.
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Date: 30 Jan 2007 14:58:46
From: Michael Daly
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Davej wrote:
> Where would I go for seals for a Henri Lloyd?
I've only seen those in sailing shops... the clothing line, not the
seals. That would be a place to look if you can't find a cheaper
alternative elsewhere. Given the premium for Henri Lloyd locally, I
think you would better off looking elsewhere. If you can't find a
suitable generic seal at a paddling shop, you could consider a scuba shop.
Mike
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Date: 30 Jan 2007 13:09:30
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Davej:
> Where would I go for seals for a Henri Lloyd?
>Are sleeve diameters standardized? Thanks.
Dunno from sleeves, but there seem tb at least 2 neck standards: the one you get
when ordering from NRS and the one used by Koketat and sold by Offshore Systems.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 25 Jan 2007 10:42:37
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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On Jan 24, 7:21 pm, Brian Nystrom <brian.nyst...@verizon.net > wrote:
> Davej wrote:
> > "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote:
> >> Davej wrote:
> >>> Ok, I will give this a try. It says to clean first with cotol, paint
> >>> thinner, or nail polish remover. I wonder which is least toxic?
> >> I've been using 70% denatured alcohol (the stuff available at
> >> drugstores/supermarkets) without any glue/adhesion problems.
>
> > Denatured not isopropyl? Thanks.
>
> Drug store alcohol is isopropyl, not denatured. Denatured alcohol
> (ethanol with enough methanol added to make it undrinkable) is found at
> hardware and paint stores, and is commonly used as a thinner for shellac
> and as a mild, general-purpose degreaser. Either one will work, but MEK
> works better, though it's more toxic.
I have acetone, mineral spirits, and two grades of isopropyl. Maybe
I'll experiment.
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Date: 26 Jan 2007 00:42:45
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Davej wrote:
> I have acetone, mineral spirits, and two grades of isopropyl. Maybe
> I'll experiment.
Don't use mineral spirits. It's oily and potentially harmful to latex.
The difference between commonly sold isopropyl alcohols is the water
content. They're usually either 70% or 91% alcohol (sold as rubbing
alcohol), though you can get 99.9+% isopropyl that's sold for other
purposes (electronics cleaning, for one). The more water, the longer it
will take to dry after cleaning, so there's no advantage to using the
more dilute grade.
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Date: 24 Jan 2007 16:03:32
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid > wrote:
> Davej wrote:
>
> >Ok, I will give this a try. It says to clean first with cotol, paint
> >thinner, or nail polish remover. I wonder which is least toxic?
>
>I've been using 70% denatured alcohol (the stuff available at
> drugstores/supermarkets) without any glue/adhesion problems.
Denatured not isopropyl? Thanks.
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Date: 24 Jan 2007 20:46:05
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Davej:
>Denatured not isopropyl? Thanks.
Oops!.... Mea culpa.
The label says isopropyl.
I thought they were one and the same.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 25 Jan 2007 01:21:32
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Davej wrote:
> "(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote:
>> Davej wrote:
>>
>>> Ok, I will give this a try. It says to clean first with cotol, paint
>>> thinner, or nail polish remover. I wonder which is least toxic?
>> I've been using 70% denatured alcohol (the stuff available at
>> drugstores/supermarkets) without any glue/adhesion problems.
>
> Denatured not isopropyl? Thanks.
Drug store alcohol is isopropyl, not denatured. Denatured alcohol
(ethanol with enough methanol added to make it undrinkable) is found at
hardware and paint stores, and is commonly used as a thinner for shellac
and as a mild, general-purpose degreaser. Either one will work, but MEK
works better, though it's more toxic.
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Date: 22 Jan 2007 15:34:14
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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cramersec@gmail.com wrote:
> On Jan 19, "Davej" <galt...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Where can I get latex to make temporary repairs? I would like to put
> > off the full replacement until later. Thanks!
>
> Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
Ok, I will give this a try. It says to clean first with cotol, paint
thinner, or nail polish remover. I wonder which is least toxic?
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Date: 23 Jan 2007 08:54:10
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Davej:
>Ok, I will give this a try. It says to clean first with cotol, paint
>thinner, or nail polish remover. I wonder which is least toxic?
I've been using 70% denatured alcohol (the stuff available at
drugstores/supermarkets) without any glue/adhesion problems.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 18:51:27
From: Davej
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Brian Nystrom wrote:
> (PeteCresswell) wrote:
> > Per Brian Nystrom:
> >> For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
> >> reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
> >> and be done with it.
> >
> > In the past, I'd been doing my neck seals on the hood of my car: lay it flat,
> > use 30-40 little magnets to hold it all together. My best time was about
> > 45 minutes for a neck seal and 2 wrist seals.
> >
> > Just did the last two neck seals with the jigs that Kokatat describes: a ring, a
> > plate to clamp the ring to, and a smaller plate to give the top of the seal some
> > shape.
> >
> > The wood I cut the jigs from was way too thick - about 3/4"... Didn't put a
> > clock on it, but it was pretty impressive how simple the process became
> > alignment-wise.
> >
> > If I can find some 1/4" polyethylene sheet to cut another set of jigs from, I
> > think it'll be even easier bc the only downside was having to arate the
> > seals/dryed glue from the wood.
>
> I used 3/8" plywood for my forms and it works well. I use clear packing
> tape to cover the areas that are likely to be exposed to glue.
So each time you replace a seal do you add another layer of rubber?
What if the original rubber layer gets really bad?
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Date: 22 Jan 2007 12:42:31
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Davej wrote:
> Brian Nystrom wrote:
>> (PeteCresswell) wrote:
>>> Per Brian Nystrom:
>>>> For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
>>>> reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
>>>> and be done with it.
>>> In the past, I'd been doing my neck seals on the hood of my car: lay it flat,
>>> use 30-40 little magnets to hold it all together. My best time was about
>>> 45 minutes for a neck seal and 2 wrist seals.
>>>
>>> Just did the last two neck seals with the jigs that Kokatat describes: a ring, a
>>> plate to clamp the ring to, and a smaller plate to give the top of the seal some
>>> shape.
>>>
>>> The wood I cut the jigs from was way too thick - about 3/4"... Didn't put a
>>> clock on it, but it was pretty impressive how simple the process became
>>> alignment-wise.
>>>
>>> If I can find some 1/4" polyethylene sheet to cut another set of jigs from, I
>>> think it'll be even easier bc the only downside was having to arate the
>>> seals/dryed glue from the wood.
>> I used 3/8" plywood for my forms and it works well. I use clear packing
>> tape to cover the areas that are likely to be exposed to glue.
>
> So each time you replace a seal do you add another layer of rubber?
No, I peel off the top layer and bond the new seal to the original. OS
Systems seal glue makes this pretty easy, as all it takes is a heat gun
to soften it.
> What if the original rubber layer gets really bad?
I haven't had that problem yet. If/when it happens, I'll remove the old
seal material and glue the new seal directly to the fabric.
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 21:59:04
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Davej:
>So each time you replace a seal do you add another layer of rubber?
>What if the original rubber layer gets really bad?
The limit's supposedly 3 layers.
The right amount of heat lets them be peeled off.
IIRC Kokatat recommends the use of a clothes iron.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 19 Jan 2007 09:40:17
From: cramersec@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
Steve
On Jan 19, 10:53 am, "Davej" <galt...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> Where can I get latex to make temporary repairs? I would like to put
> off the full replacement until later. Thanks!
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Date: 19 Jan 2007 18:01:08
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per cramersec@gmail.com:
>Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
Now that somebody's said it, I'd think bicycle inner tubes would be good -
thinner, more flexy.... and they're available in different materials, although I
don't have a clue what the significance on one material vs the other would be
for gasket repair.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 02:26:39
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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(PeteCresswell) wrote:
> Per cramersec@gmail.com:
>> Old inner tubes and Aquaseal has worked for me.
>
> Now that somebody's said it, I'd think bicycle inner tubes would be good -
> thinner, more flexy.... and they're available in different materials, although I
> don't have a clue what the significance on one material vs the other would be
> for gasket repair.
For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
and be done with it.
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 08:55:38
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Brian Nystrom:
>For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
>reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
>and be done with it.
In the past, I'd been doing my neck seals on the hood of my car: lay it flat,
use 30-40 little magnets to hold it all together. My best time was about
45 minutes for a neck seal and 2 wrist seals.
Just did the last two neck seals with the jigs that Kokatat describes: a ring, a
plate to clamp the ring to, and a smaller plate to give the top of the seal some
shape.
The wood I cut the jigs from was way too thick - about 3/4"... Didn't put a
clock on it, but it was pretty impressive how simple the process became
alignment-wise.
If I can find some 1/4" polyethylene sheet to cut another set of jigs from, I
think it'll be even easier bc the only downside was having to arate the
seals/dryed glue from the wood.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 20:10:53
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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(PeteCresswell) wrote:
> Per Brian Nystrom:
>> For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
>> reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
>> and be done with it.
>
> In the past, I'd been doing my neck seals on the hood of my car: lay it flat,
> use 30-40 little magnets to hold it all together. My best time was about
> 45 minutes for a neck seal and 2 wrist seals.
>
> Just did the last two neck seals with the jigs that Kokatat describes: a ring, a
> plate to clamp the ring to, and a smaller plate to give the top of the seal some
> shape.
>
> The wood I cut the jigs from was way too thick - about 3/4"... Didn't put a
> clock on it, but it was pretty impressive how simple the process became
> alignment-wise.
>
> If I can find some 1/4" polyethylene sheet to cut another set of jigs from, I
> think it'll be even easier bc the only downside was having to arate the
> seals/dryed glue from the wood.
I used 3/8" plywood for my forms and it works well. I use clear packing
tape to cover the areas that are likely to be exposed to glue.
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 18:18:02
From: Carey Robson
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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I use handy wrap to cover my pvc pipe before repairing. I also try to do
just the outer edge first and also cover it with handy wrap to stop the GOOP
from running. Sometimes the Handy Wrap comes off and sometimes it doesn't.
It doesn't really matter. The best thing is to have some spare seals. Once
one part tears the rest is on its way.
Sincerely,
Carey Robson
www.CanoeBC.ca
"(PeteCresswell)" <x@y.Invalid > wrote in message
news:mf74r2197a22meutlja7in2pcco3v9jvau@4ax.com...
> Per Brian Nystrom:
>>For that matter, you can use tube patches to repair rips and holes or to
>>reinforce damaged edges. However, it's not difficult to replace the seal
>>and be done with it.
>
> In the past, I'd been doing my neck seals on the hood of my car: lay it
> flat,
> use 30-40 little magnets to hold it all together. My best time was
> about
> 45 minutes for a neck seal and 2 wrist seals.
>
> Just did the last two neck seals with the jigs that Kokatat describes: a
> ring, a
> plate to clamp the ring to, and a smaller plate to give the top of the
> seal some
> shape.
>
> The wood I cut the jigs from was way too thick - about 3/4"... Didn't put
> a
> clock on it, but it was pretty impressive how simple the process became
> alignment-wise.
>
> If I can find some 1/4" polyethylene sheet to cut another set of jigs
> from, I
> think it'll be even easier bc the only downside was having to arate the
> seals/dryed glue from the wood.
> --
> PeteCresswell
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 13:55:58
From: (PeteCresswell)
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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Per Carey Robson:
> The best thing is to have some spare seals. Once
>one part tears the rest is on its way.
Do you find there's a shelf life issue? Everything I've heard so far about
seals is that they have a maximum life of about five years - and more often
three or four. Something about the rubber breaking down internally.
--
PeteCresswell
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Date: 20 Jan 2007 20:09:06
From: Brian Nystrom
Subject: Re: Dry Suit Seals: Temporary Repairs?
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(PeteCresswell) wrote:
> Per Carey Robson:
>> The best thing is to have some spare seals. Once
>> one part tears the rest is on its way.
>
> Do you find there's a shelf life issue? Everything I've heard so far about
> seals is that they have a maximum life of about five years - and more often
> three or four. Something about the rubber breaking down internally.
I haven't found storage to be a problem as long as the seals are kept in
sealed plastic bags and out of the light.
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